Useless eaters

レオタルドのフェティッシュ

Existence is but a diabolic deception
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I've seen many great men and women throughout history who contributed to humanity, no doubt they are amazing and they build the world as we know it and will certainly achieve more than any of us here ever will. But I can't help but to witness outside of them the onslaught of stupidity across the world. Most of such people don't do anything really useful in life, they just eat up the harvest brought by the former's hard work and intellectual prowess, leaving them offspring to continue the deed later on. And the brightest ones, who were an alarmingly small portion of the populace, will continue to bear their burden. In the end, there will always be a million idiots for a genius out there. And how are we going to change that? We probably can't and won't, or maybe I'm just projecting.
 
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Ticbow2003

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The thing is with this outlook is that it's always been relevant. There will always be those more intelligent than the rest who will view the rest as stupid. It's all subjective.
We currently live in a world where 100 IQ is the average and anyone over that is a genius. However, if the world was that of an average IQ of 150, a world of geniuses from our perspective, those above that would be genius. In reality, we will never be able to change these proportions due to the subjectivity of them. Some may think that in the past IQ was higher because people spoke in a more 'intelligent' way, but the average IQ just 100 years ago was 70.
The other point is that the people who may not necessarily be making big leaps in society are still contributing in their own way. Sure, Bob down the chippy may not be making great scientific leaps or anything like that, but he's making other people's lives better either by either providing them with delicious food, or by simply having a nice chat with them. To imply that those who aren't making great contributions to society are less than valueable is reallty an ignorant point of view. You need to analyze these people on a case by case basis. There are those few who, I agree, make no difference to society. However they are few and far between.

Ultimately, my belief is that if someone makes someone else's life better, in any way, they are valueable no matter their contribution to greater society or their IQ.
 
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I've seen many great men and women throughout history who contributed to humanity, no doubt they are amazing and they build the world as we know it and will certainly achieve more than any of us here ever will. But I can't help but to witness outside of them the onslaught of stupidity across the world. Most of such people don't do anything really useful in life, they just eat up the harvest brought by the former's hard work and intellectual prowess, leaving them offspring to continue the deed later on. And the brightest ones, who were an alarmingly small portion of the populace, will continue to bear their burden. In the end, there will always be a million idiots for a genius out there. And how are we going to change that? We probably can't and won't, or maybe I'm just projecting.
Sounds like eugenics narrative, but that's the thing, everyone is important, we are nuts and bolts for the machine we call civilization, what you think of those "eaters" is superficial, because you see, you don't need to be a great mind to contribute something to society, you see the majority needs the minority, and the minority needs the majority, the workers are the one who build the machine, industrial plants, farming, transportation, the higher minds preffer to sit in their couch all day thinking, but without the lower minds, their medium would be impossible, because they personally can't grow the crops, drive the cars, or give the funds to said projects to be a reality, just tell me, does Elon Musk or any of his scientists has ever grabbed a pickaxe in his precious diamond mines? They don't, you see, everyone has a reason, and is a highly important member to society, because humanity is a highly social being, we crave for love, for purpose, for actions, no one wants to live like a parasite (besides a very few exceptions), so they act, our work in this world is always try to make a better living condition for us and those who needs it.

Also "will certainly achieve more than us here ever will" why does that really matters tho? Are you implying that the only purpose of humanity is to contribute to the colony and just die? If that's the case, that's a worrying mindset partner, we are not ants, being a genius doesn't means you are gonna be better than everyone else, in fact that does not define your happiness at all, most geniuses had ended up with miserable lifes, Oppenheimer, Alan Turing, Archimedes, Marie Curie, fucking hawkins had the mobility of a pickle, he was, indeed, pickle steve, not counting the numerous minds that went into oblivion, or never rocketed in the first place, i've been met hobos with more intelligence than the so called "geniuses" while i had to see spoiled kids living better lifes than any of them, just because they were born, is an unfair world, and everything is an spectrum, at the end what matters is what you want in this life, if you think contribute to something is gonna fulfill your deepest desires, that your dreams are gonna become a reality, go ahead, but never dismiss others by not being paired at your same level.

Not mentioning that there are a lot of kinds of intelligence, not only logical, you can be a genius in so many of them, humans are not all a collective mind, we all are different, and we live under different context, some others are dumb in certain things, and some others are completely geniuses in other tasks, if we are all logical, everyone would be an engineer, if we are all creative, we are all gonna be artists, we can't just be a mass produced da vinci, IQ is just a mere number and will never decide your success or failures.
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Ticbow2003

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being a genius doesn't means you are gonna be better than everyone else, in fact that does not define your happiness at all, most geniuses had ended up with miserable lifes, Oppenheimer, Alan Turing, Archimedes, Marie Curie, fucking hawkins had the mobility of a pickle, he was, indeed, pickle steve, not counting the numerous minds that went into oblivion, or never rocketed in the first place, i've been met hobos with more intelligence than the so called "geniuses" while i had to see spoiled kids living better lifes than any of them, just because they were born, is an unfair world, and everything is an spectrum, at the end what matters is what you want in this life, if you think contribute to something is gonna fulfill your deepest desires, that your dreams are gonna become a reality, go ahead, but never dismiss others by not being paired at your same level.

Not mentioning that there are a lot of kinds of intelligence, not only logical, you can be a genius in so many of them, humans are not all a collective mind, we all are different, and we live under different context, some others are dumb in certain things, and some others are completely geniuses in other tasks, if we are all logical, everyone would be an engineer, if we are all creative, we are all gonna be artists, we can't just be a mass produced da vinci, IQ is just a mere number and will never decide your success or failures.
Yes! This is exactly what I was thinking, just couldn't get it into words properly. Massive respect my dude!
 
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I've seen many great men and women throughout history who contributed to humanity, no doubt they are amazing and they build the world as we know it and will certainly achieve more than any of us here ever will. But I can't help but to witness outside of them the onslaught of stupidity across the world. Most of such people don't do anything really useful in life, they just eat up the harvest brought by the former's hard work and intellectual prowess, leaving them offspring to continue the deed later on. And the brightest ones, who were an alarmingly small portion of the populace, will continue to bear their burden. In the end, there will always be a million idiots for a genius out there. And how are we going to change that? We probably can't and won't, or maybe I'm just projecting.
I dislike the concept of "useless eaters". That implies that people have to be useful in some way and cannot just exist because... it's simply their purpose to do so? To simply exist and make their own experiences in life? Some people are meant to build, others to serve, others to create, others to fight. In my opinion, there's no true useless eater out there. It's simply that society has become so focused on getting people to consume while simultaneously blaming them for these behaviours that many people's purposes are overshadowed. In the world that we live in, it is no surprise people would rather dissociate and eat fast food than do anything productive: we are robbed of our potential from a very young age, turned into shells of ourselves by a system that wants to produce the same kind of docile worker. Our spirits are broken not just by education, but also by the media, which constantly touts apocalypse, catastrophe, and bad news, and pushes an agenda 99% of the time, by the destruction of human relationships by governments and those who make the system, by the reductivist perspective of "science and hard facts only" that is pushed nowadays. When you're not connected to a higher power, even if it's simply the dream you are chasing, your existence becomes purposeless. A lack of purpose, loneliness, a sense of not being in control of one's destiny, is the gateway to all kinds of addiction. Crackheads and alcoholics are shamed, but the truth is, society loves us to be addicted to something. There's always some profit to make. Even if it's extremely dirty and destructive.

It is a fact that geniuses are rare. An unfortunate one really. But "genius" doesn't mean "god" or "saint". There are many geniuses who are insufferable assholes or just make no use of their potential. Others kill themselves before they have the time to do so. Not so many truly manage to make it. But is this a reason to consider the "idiots" as inferior?

You can be of lower intelligence and still make something valuable. A mother can be dumb as bricks, but be at the same time a really, really good parent. Even this is good. A well-raised child will be a happy adult most of the time. This is a contribution no one sees. Others are not really intellectually gifted, but are great at building houses, or woodworking, or simply filling in papers. Is this inferior? Not at all! It's still very valuable. There are no useless eaters in this world. Only people. Too many, yes. Many not really intelligent, yes. But don't fall into the trap of "I'm smarter than everyone else". It just makes you seem like a pompous asshole. And between us... ignorance is bliss. Truly.

A beloved philosopher of mine once said: "I think to myself blessed is he who is silly and carefree." And I agree with him. Blessed be the one who is silly and carefree. Bless the "idiot". Bless the "useless eater".
 
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Pink Fluffy Cat

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All shitposting and trolling aside, I don't think you can blame the "useless eaters" for being the way they are. No one's born a consoomers - at least I believe so, and it's not their fault when the society and the MSM consistantly push the narrative of "work, buy, pay and die = normacy". And it's just too difficult to resist the temptation when you have to spent the majority of your energy into 40 hours long full times job. Barbara Ehrenreich has wrote a book back in 2000s about how wageslavery in general has made people NPC cattle in literal sense, and it aged suprising well, as nothing has changed since then.
 

dorgon

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I've seen many great men and women throughout history who contributed to humanity, no doubt they are amazing and they build the world as we know it and will certainly achieve more than any of us here ever will. But I can't help but to witness outside of them the onslaught of stupidity across the world. Most of such people don't do anything really useful in life, they just eat up the harvest brought by the former's hard work and intellectual prowess, leaving them offspring to continue the deed later on. And the brightest ones, who were an alarmingly small portion of the populace, will continue to bear their burden. In the end, there will always be a million idiots for a genius out there. And how are we going to change that? We probably can't and won't, or maybe I'm just projecting.
useless eater? dawg wtf? you acting like the normal person trying to live their life is a "useless eater"? sure, there are millions of people out there with average minds, as compared to a genius, but that doesn't make them any more or less "useless" to civilization. It's not like everyone's goal in life is to strive to be the greatest, or to invent the best thing, some people's goal in life is to simply keep their family and themselves secure and happy, and millions, if not billions of people throughout history have done that without need of fame nor fortune. What is "useful in life"? What is useful in YOUR life? MY life? It's all different. Sure there are the brainless stupid consoomers out there who work just to buy the next product from their favorite brand, but all around the globe there are people who are "useful in life", they provide for themselves, their families, and their community. And if that makes them happy, then that is good for them. We don't have to strive to become the next Einstein or Tesla or Jonas Salk. If you got a life changing idea though, then go through with it, but it's still good to improve the life of just yourself and your loved ones. The inventors didn't think people were going to "eat the fruits of their labor" or however you put it, they made inventions to either make money or to genuinely improve the lives of other people. To say that the other people are leeching off of inventors is disingenuous.
 
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RisingThumb

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I've seen many great men and women throughout history who contributed to humanity, no doubt they are amazing and they build the world as we know it and will certainly achieve more than any of us here ever will. But I can't help but to witness outside of them the onslaught of stupidity across the world. Most of such people don't do anything really useful in life, they just eat up the harvest brought by the former's hard work and intellectual prowess, leaving them offspring to continue the deed later on. And the brightest ones, who were an alarmingly small portion of the populace, will continue to bear their burden. In the end, there will always be a million idiots for a genius out there. And how are we going to change that? We probably can't and won't, or maybe I'm just projecting.
Look up the Malthusian theory of population. Additionally, look up what happens to genetically identical or similar groups. They tend to die off(genetically engineer crops) or suffer. It's in our benefit to have genetic variations. Regarding the Malthusian theory of population, we're not at the limit our planet can support given our technological advances, so unless it becomes a limiting factor that A LOT of people can agree to do something about, it's not gonna change.

That said, I support the idea of eugenics in subtle ways like supporting abortion, and so on- since almost nobody wants to raise a child disabled from birth. Unfortunately most disabilities come about through life, or are just lurking and hidden until they spring out at a random time in your life(mental disabilities, and stuff like Fibromyalgia).

How are we going to change that? Unfortunately your choices are: Eugenics(at varying levels of forcefulness in this regard), or don't.

If you're on this forum, chances are, you're a useless eater, much like me(sure I hold a software development job, but my work actively makes the world worse) :D
 
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mauer

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I've seen many great men and women throughout history who contributed to humanity, no doubt they are amazing and they build the world as we know it and will certainly achieve more than any of us here ever will. But I can't help but to witness outside of them the onslaught of stupidity across the world. Most of such people don't do anything really useful in life, they just eat up the harvest brought by the former's hard work and intellectual prowess, leaving them offspring to continue theY deed later on. And the brightest ones, who were an alarmingly small portion of the populace, will continue to bear their burden. In the end, there will always be a million idiots for a genius out there. And how are we going to change that? We probably can't and won't, or maybe I'm just projecting.
You're a useless eater. You are not a Napoleon or a Plato or a Machiavelli or a Mao Zedong.
Quit your bellyaching and knock off the Malthusian-esque bullshit.
 

punishedgnome

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I've seen many great men and women throughout history who contributed to humanity, no doubt they are amazing and they build the world as we know it and will certainly achieve more than any of us here ever will. But I can't help but to witness outside of them the onslaught of stupidity across the world. Most of such people don't do anything really useful in life, they just eat up the harvest brought by the former's hard work and intellectual prowess, leaving them offspring to continue the deed later on. And the brightest ones, who were an alarmingly small portion of the populace, will continue to bear their burden. In the end, there will always be a million idiots for a genius out there. And how are we going to change that? We probably can't and won't, or maybe I'm just projecting.
TBH, I don't think anyone who wastes calories posting on a vaporwave/Y2K Nostalgia forum has any room to call anyone else a useless eater, myself included.

*Edit* I think it's also important to note that if civilization collapses, most of the Silicon Valley engineers will most likely starve and Jedediah with an IQ of 82 who can barely read and can't turn on the computer living in the countryside with a bunch of guns and a fishing gear is going to have a shot at surviving. Who actually needs who?
 
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UCD

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do you think the person who figured out how to make fire was mad at everyone else for being stupid and lazy? I agree that most people have bad morals and goals, but what are you going to do? Its a lot better overall than it has been in all of history. People used to believe in witches for fucks sake, get some perspective. Dumb annoying people have always existed, and will always exist, and to someone you are that person you are complaining about. I personally think people are getting smarter on average, simply because of a higher average quality of education throughout the world as a whole. The traditionalist doomer "society is falling" thing is fake and people have been saying that for all of time.
 
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Jessica3cho雪血⊜青意

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A scattered intelligence spectrum is unavoidable. Say we killed everyone below an IQ of 120 right now, what would happen? We would still have people who are less intellectually capable than others. In fact, we would theoretically have a higher ratio of an intellectual deficit, as there is already a good portion greater of the population who has an IQ of 120 compared to those at 130.
[Weschler IV FSIQ sourced for numerical scaling of the average FSIQ bell curve]
Anyways, aside from discussing the logistics of intellectual scarcity, I'm more interested in what ethics and principles brings you to consider those who are cogs in a complex machine to be useless eaters. Surely you wouldn't say that the hood of your car is a waste of space and materials, simply because it plays a more minor role than your engine block does, right?
 
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Our spirits are broken not just by education, but also by the media, which constantly touts apocalypse, catastrophe, and bad news, and pushes an agenda 99% of the time, by the destruction of human relationships by governments and those who make the system, by the reductivist perspective of "science and hard facts only" that is pushed nowadays. When you're not connected to a higher power, even if it's simply the dream you are chasing, your existence becomes purposeless. A lack of purpose, loneliness, a sense of not being in control of one's destiny, is the gateway to all kinds of addiction. Crackheads and alcoholics are shamed, but the truth is, society loves us to be addicted to something. There's always some profit to make. Even if it's extremely dirty and destructive.

Jesus of Suburbia Lyrics​

[Part I: Jesus of Suburbia]

[Verse 1: Billie Joe Armstrong]
I'm the son of rage and love
The Jesus of Suburbia

The bible of "none of the above"
On a steady diet of
Soda-pop and Ritalin

No one ever died for my sins in Hell
As far as I can tell
'Least the ones I got away with
[Chorus: Billie Joe Armstrong]

And there's nothin' wrong with me
This is how I'm supposed to be
In a land of make-believe
That don't believe in me
 
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stonehead

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I've seen many great men and women throughout history who contributed to humanity, no doubt they are amazing and they build the world as we know it and will certainly achieve more than any of us here ever will. But I can't help but to witness outside of them the onslaught of stupidity across the world. Most of such people don't do anything really useful in life, they just eat up the harvest brought by the former's hard work and intellectual prowess, leaving them offspring to continue the deed later on. And the brightest ones, who were an alarmingly small portion of the populace, will continue to bear their burden. In the end, there will always be a million idiots for a genius out there. And how are we going to change that? We probably can't and won't, or maybe I'm just projecting.
So the problem is that there are people who never do anything "useful" in their life? I think part of the cause of that is that there just aren't 8 billion different "useful" things that need doing. People get jobs so that they can afford to keep living, not because there are urgent jobs that desperately need to be done.

That of course depends on how you define "useful" though. You could measure usefulness in economic prosperity, but I don't like that definition. This futurist Nick Land predicts that "the economy" might outlive the humanity that created it. The grossly oversimplified version of his argument is that we've automated a lot of the manufacturing process, and now we're starting to replace a lot of business decision-making with computer algorithms and ai. One day, if we continue replacing people, a company may exist with no human input. We might one day wipe ourselves out, and leave behind a bunch of computers trading stocks with each other.

The economy would be great in such a world, but I see it as a horrible outcome, so measuring "usefulness" through technological advancement or economic output seem like pretty bad ideas.

The only way to measure "usefulness" that makes sense to me is to measure the happiness of living beings. If some line chef is only working for a pay check, and doesn't advance society, but he makes good pancakes, that make his diners happy, I personally would consider that a useful job.

I'll even go one step farther and say if someone lives their life making only themself happy without hurting anyone else, they've lived a useful life. People don't need to contribute to anything to justify their existence. Instead we're the measurement we use to justify things. Things are useful based on how they affect us.
 
Even though you might perceive the useless eaters to not have a role in our society literally everyone has a role, except the people experiencing homelessness.

All the worthless teenagers making tik tok videos all day and trying to reach the status of influencer? They influence other young dumb normies to buy things with daddy's or mommy's credit card. What about the people engaged in exclusively hedonistic activities all day? 90% of those activities involve spending money! Even if they don't produce the things you deem interesting or valuable, they are engaging with the economy and are moving money around and expending energy. Consumption drives our economy. Try to live without consumption. Near impossible. Besides, even if they don't become engineers/scientists we still need everyone else from cooks, hairdressers, mechanics, amazon drivers, to machine operators. The biggest tragedy here, and my assumption of the reason you consider them worthless is because they aren't productive according to your metric.

I would love to see the open and wide availability of training for the youth so they can become productive members of society, that is not what we have today. Imagine letting kids in high school take the last two years to learn a trade? Instead of aimless youth, they could get right to work using a valuable skill. Today we make you choose your path in middle/high school and you better hope thats a viable path 4-6 years later. Big surprise that a lot of those formerly gleaming paths are now junk. I know a guy with training and education in early education, but they actually work as an amazon warehouse worker.

How do you even define and measure someone's contribution to society? I write software thats needed in case you want to use our product, but the overall value to society is quite low. I don't think I make a positive contribution to society. Unless you use our product and give us money, you aren't going to be needing or find this software useful.

That we have homeless at all is an incredible tragedy. Its a waste of resources, and a waste of money to leave someone on the streets in an unproductive status. Druggies should be kidnapped off the streets and forced into rehab. They can exit when they complete rehab, have job training, and are making a steady living. Training should be as plentiful as water.

"Give a man a fish and you feed him for a day. Teach him how to fish and you feed him for a lifetime" - Chinese philosopher Lao Tzu
 
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