A System Update for Manpaint

[manpaint]

Current protocol dictates that I should look into verifying my current modus operandi to check for errors and improvements. Doing so alone would be unwise as my perception of myself is naturally biased. As I need "external observers", I thought it would be wise to invoke the knowledge of people from the Agora Road to collect data.

The Function​

As it currently stands, my life is orienting towards the concept of "sustaining eternity". This will be reffered as "the function". Eternity is defined as follow in a technological context:

A piece of software is classified as "eternal" if it was ensured that it can run without internet on a fresh OS install and given a compatible hardware configuration is provided. Sustaining eternity generally takes the form of software archiving. This years, important events were as follow:

-Managed to preserve my Windows 7 configuration and ensured that Microsoft's DRM will not get in the way should a failure state exists.
-Archived most of the software I use and ensured it was "eternity compliant"
-Figured out a viable preservation paradigm to archive a MMORPG called RuneScape 3.

The Directional Principles​

I have a set of 11 principles that currently governed my life:

• Seek knowledge, as it will bring you great power.
• Avoid love at all cost, as it will only poison your mind.
• Brace yourself for the worst outcome, do not believe in hope.
• Silence is golden, only speak when absolutely necessary.
• There is no good or evil, only people.
• Do not make changes, unless a function is no longer fufilled.
• Simplicity is key, complexity only bring calamity.
• To dream is only summoning suffering.
• Regardless of what you do, you do not deserve anything.
• Chasing after morals is in vain.

The details are as follow:

Seek knowledge: Information is very valuable in our current world; especially when it come to technology. The power of knowledge can be often observed when using computers.

Avoid love at all cost: I perceive serotonin - the phenomena that happens when you encounter love (or a potential avenue for it) as no different than a drug. While I have never consummed any illicit substance, I find the way it essentially "hack" your brain with positive feeling and addiction extremely dangerous and disturbing. Main directive regarding this is to purge all avenue where this can occur. It has an effect comparable to social media addiction which I have decided to avoid at all cost.

Brace yourself for the worst outcome: My brain automatically long for the most positive outcome, which has a very statistically low chance to occur. As a result, it is better to expect the absolute worse and be suprised.

Silence is golden: From my past observation, it is wiser to never speak up. In general, people are neutral towards you by default. If you only speak up when necessary peope will come to perceive you as "the guy who never cause any trouble". This most applicable in real life.

There is no good or evil, only people: I refute the notion that good and evil exists. People simply have objectives. Those two notions are subjective by their nature and can vary wildy by nature.

Do not make changes, unless a function is no longer fufilled: This feed into the Eternity idea. I believe that while changes themselves are not inherently good or bad, a large quantity of it can be pure anathema. I believe humans react to a large amount of change negatively, especially if it happens in a short period. As a result, I am extremly careful and considerate in that regard. Every change I make must have a net positive.

Simplicity is key, complexity only bring calamity: Complex system are more likely to be inefficient. I try to reduce everything to it's simplest expression so I can have a clearer vision of reality.

To dream is only summoning suffering: Pretty much the same thing as "Brace yourself for the worst outcome".

Regardless of what you do, you do not deserve anything: The term "deserve" imply that someone or something is handing out a reward. I do not believe in thing such as a karma system. See religion section for more details.

Chasing after morals is in vain: Intellectually chasing morals is a futile thing. Again, having morals imply that there is some sort of over-arching system that will reward you in the end. That being said, being perceived as a moral person obviously has some positive societal implications. Avoid being seen as an immoral person by society, but do do not prevent yourself from eating chocolate even if you know it's being made by slaves.

Main mindset​

As it currently stands, my main mindset is to behave very methodically - emulating the behavior of a computer or an AI. The main paradigm of this is as follow:

Do not trust your brain to record information.

Human memory is unreliable and data can easily be forgotten. Write everything down - whatever is it on paper on a text file. Additionally, my life is directed by a master schedule spreadsheet and computer reminders.

Politics​

I tend to not involve myself in politics, especially in real life as I see it as mindless tribalism. I believe that people lacking knowledge should not be able to participate in political debates and so this rule should also apply to me. I do sometimes like to engage in intellectual conversation, but they are mostly just thought experiments at best.

Religion​

Currently agnostic. From the little I know of history, it is quite clear that spirituality is a base function of humans being. While this do not argue for or against the existence of a higher power it proves that religion is not the design of a singular society. I personally believe that there is probably something, although I am indecisive if it is benevolent or not.

I believe that there must be at least some sort of design to it all. According to my archives, the first time I played RuneScape in 2011, my first though was trying to recreate the game in some very barebone flash project. All the games I have made where inspired by RuneScape to some degree.

Earlier this year, I decided to drop my RuneScape 3 preservation project as I had reached an impasse. Doing so made my life incredibly empty. I eventually managed to find another way around this issue and I suddently felt that I "regained my soul". It's hard to think that there is not some kind of higher design to this.

Closing notes​

If the purpose of this thread is not clear, please let me re-iterate:
I want you to attempt to challenge and destroy my world views to confirm their strength. So please, do not hesitate be harsh (while still being civil). I will be grateful to anyone who will write a meaningful reply.

All is for Eternity.​

 

[RisingThumb]

Current protocol dictates that I should look into verifying my current modus operandi to check for errors and improvements. Doing so alone would be unwise as my perception of myself is naturally biased. As I need "external observers", I thought it would be wise to invoke the knowledge of people from the Agora Road to collect data.

The Function​

As it currently stands, my life is orienting towards the concept of "sustaining eternity". This will be reffered as "the function". Eternity is defined as follow in a technological context:

A piece of software is classified as "eternal" if it was ensured that it can run without internet on a fresh OS install and given a compatible hardware configuration is provided. Sustaining eternity generally takes the form of software archiving. This years, important events were as follow:

-Managed to preserve my Windows 7 configuration and ensured that Microsoft's DRM will not get in the way should a failure state exists.
-Archived most of the software I use and ensured it was "eternity compliant"
-Figured out a viable preservation paradigm to archive a MMORPG called RuneScape 3.

The Directional Principles​

I have a set of 11 principles that currently governed my life:

• Seek knowledge, as it will bring you great power.
• Avoid love at all cost, as it will only poison your mind.
• Brace yourself for the worst outcome, do not believe in hope.
• Silence is golden, only speak when absolutely necessary.
• There is no good or evil, only people.
• Do not make changes, unless a function is no longer fufilled.
• Simplicity is key, complexity only bring calamity.
• To dream is only summoning suffering.
• Regardless of what you do, you do not deserve anything.
• Chasing after morals is in vain.

The details are as follow:

Seek knowledge: Information is very valuable in our current world; especially when it come to technology. The power of knowledge can be often observed when using computers.

Avoid love at all cost: I perceive serotonin - the phenomena that happens when you encounter love (or a potential avenue for it) as no different than a drug. While I have never consummed any illicit substance, I find the way it essentially "hack" your brain with positive feeling and addiction extremely dangerous and disturbing. Main directive regarding this is to purge all avenue where this can occur. It has an effect comparable to social media addiction which I have decided to avoid at all cost.

Brace yourself for the worst outcome: My brain automatically long for the most positive outcome, which has a very statistically low chance to occur. As a result, it is better to expect the absolute worse and be suprised.

Silence is golden: From my past observation, it is wiser to never speak up. In general, people are neutral towards you by default. If you only speak up when necessary peope will come to perceive you as "the guy who never cause any trouble". This most applicable in real life.

There is no good or evil, only people: I refute the notion that good and evil exists. People simply have objectives. Those two notions are subjective by their nature and can vary wildy by nature.

Do not make changes, unless a function is no longer fufilled: This feed into the Eternity idea. I believe that while changes themselves are not inherently good or bad, a large quantity of it can be pure anathema. I believe humans react to a large amount of change negatively, especially if it happens in a short period. As a result, I am extremly careful and considerate in that regard. Every change I make must have a net positive.

Simplicity is key, complexity only bring calamity: Complex system are more likely to be inefficient. I try to reduce everything to it's simplest expression so I can have a clearer vision of reality.

To dream is only summoning suffering: Pretty much the same thing as "Brace yourself for the worst outcome".

Regardless of what you do, you do not deserve anything: The term "deserve" imply that someone or something is handing out a reward. I do not believe in thing such as a karma system. See religion section for more details.

Chasing after morals is in vain: Intellectually chasing morals is a futile thing. Again, having morals imply that there is some sort of over-arching system that will reward you in the end. That being said, being perceived as a moral person obviously has some positive societal implications. Avoid being seen as an immoral person by society, but do do not prevent yourself from eating chocolate even if you know it's being made by slaves.

Main mindset​

As it currently stands, my main mindset is to behave very methodically - emulating the behavior of a computer or an AI. The main paradigm of this is as follow:

Do not trust your brain to record information.

Human memory is unreliable and data can easily be forgotten. Write everything down - whatever is it on paper on a text file. Additionally, my life is directed by a master schedule spreadsheet and computer reminders.

Politics​

I tend to not involve myself in politics, especially in real life as I see it as mindless tribalism. I believe that people lacking knowledge should not be able to participate in political debates and so this rule should also apply to me. I do sometimes like to engage in intellectual conversation, but they are mostly just thought experiments at best.

Religion​

Currently agnostic. From the little I know of history, it is quite clear that spirituality is a base function of humans being. While this do not argue for or against the existence of a higher power it proves that religion is not the design of a singular society. I personally believe that there is probably something, although I am indecisive if it is benevolent or not.

I believe that there must be at least some sort of design to it all. According to my archives, the first time I played RuneScape in 2011, my first though was trying to recreate the game in some very barebone flash project. All the games I have made where inspired by RuneScape to some degree.

Earlier this year, I decided to drop my RuneScape 3 preservation project as I had reached an impasse. Doing so made my life incredibly empty. I eventually managed to find another way around this issue and I suddently felt that I "regained my soul". It's hard to think that there is not some kind of higher design to this.

Closing notes​

If the purpose of this thread is not clear, please let me re-iterate:
I want you to attempt to challenge and destroy my world views to confirm their strength. So please, do not hesitate be harsh (while still being civil). I will be grateful to anyone who will write a meaningful reply.

All is for Eternity.​

If knowledge is your highest priority, read "The Unique and its property". You'll then learn you're an involuntary egoist, establishing these principles out of your own morality. You'll then learn that all morality is a spook. Then you'll realise "Chasing after morals is in vain." and "Seek knowledge, as it will bring you great power." Is contradictory, and your principles are formed out of morality(after all how can you consider a "good" or a "bad" principle? Even utilitarian thinking is a morality).

This post is in contradiction of "Silence is golden, only speak when absolutely necessary.", so your post is already in contradiction of your post.

"Avoid love at all cost, as it will only poison your mind.", is life-denying, as love is nothing more than your biology, just like hunger, thirst, needing to use the toilet, blinking, breathing, and all the various emotions that "poison" your mind like envy, lust, jealousy, pride etc- of which I personally think are very useful as they are motivators towards self-improvement.

"There is no good or evil, only people.". You have formulated a set of moral principles to guide you, thus there is good and evil in accordance to those principles.

"Regardless of what you do, you do not deserve anything.". If my featherless biped, you believe you do not deserve anything, then follow it through to its end point Diogenes the lesser.

"To dream is only summoning suffering.". If you seek knowledge, look into Carl Jung- you'll see the folly of claiming dreams only summon suffering.

"Brace yourself for the worst outcome, do not believe in hope.". All mathematics is based on Axioms, which are fundamental truths you must believe in otherwise the entire subject cannot exist. I will imply here that disbelief in hope, is also a rejection of all belief(since your writing style clues me that)- which is a rejection of all systems based on axioms.

"Simplicity is key, complexity only bring calamity.". There is a degree to which this is true, however simplify too far and you have a calamity. It's like a piece of music, you should use no more or less notes than you need.

 

[LostintheCycle]

I won't mention your view of morals because RisingThumbs already did a good post on it. I'm gonna take a shot at something else.

My suspicion is that you enjoy the feeling of trying to be something neutral and objective because it makes you feel apart from or better than other people, because everyone knows that logic is always better than feeling at all times in everything whatsoever. It's glaringly obvious in your writing because you deliberately choose technical, inhuman words which sacrifice what you really mean but they look "objective". You had to define what 'the function' was just so you could use the word 'function' where you could have just said 'goal', 'desire', 'want', or 'aim'. You came here to 'collect data', but actually you came here seeking 'viewpoints', 'perspectives', or 'opinions'. You make a real effort to present yourself as the rational person you believe yourself to be. In your own words, you emulate the behavior of a computer or AI, so you understand that like a computer that emulates hardware, your emulation of thinking methodologically happens on top of the blobby mass in your head which is driven by human thoughts, feelings, and those things. I don't think you realize how much that blobby mass seeps through.

To begin with, your desire to think like a computer is irrational because you have no actual reason to do it; you don't have a lofty goal that would require it, nor will it help your survive another day. I would guess that your desire to do that stems from that same desire as before, to be apart from or better than other people. Next, your goals in life just revolve around archiving shit on your computer. You are a digital hoarder. You have given no pretense to why you do this, and in case you claim it's just preservation of software history, I say back that it's very easy for to create a fake justification on the spot for whatever we do. We can even lie to ourselves about why we do what we do, and genuinely believe, but that doesn't change what the truth is. The truth is often too ugly for ourselves. Is there even the tiniest thought deep within that there actually is some irrational reason you hoard files, that you've been too uncomfortable to admit to yourself before?

This brings me to one of your principles which I thought was interesting. Avoid love at all cost, as it will only poison your mind. First of all, these sound like the words of someone with little to no experience, or maybe a bad experience with love, but I'll give the benefit of doubt because I'm not focused on that. I think that these could be the words of someone who so desperately wants to prove how rational they are, they'll flaunt how they don't believe in that irrational thing that all the other irrational people do! But while you obsess over the obvious ways to display rationality, you fail to see what's underneath your own facade, which is that ugly unshakeable web of desires and fears, without reason, and that desperate scrambling inside yourself for homeostasis.

So evaluate yourself fundamentally. What are you hiding from yourself? Are you really 'rational'? What are your desires you don't want to admit that you have?
I hope you may find the truth in yourself manpaint, whether it was as I described or not.

 

[RisingThumb]

I won't mention your view of morals because RisingThumbs already did a good post on it. I'm gonna take a shot at something else.

My suspicion is that you enjoy the feeling of trying to be something neutral and objective because it makes you feel apart from or better than other people, because everyone knows that logic is always better than feeling at all times in everything whatsoever. It's glaringly obvious in your writing because you deliberately choose technical, inhuman words which sacrifice what you really mean but they look "objective". You had to define what 'the function' was just so you could use the word 'function' where you could have just said 'goal', 'desire', 'want', or 'aim'. You came here to 'collect data', but actually you came here seeking 'viewpoints', 'perspectives', or 'opinions'. You make a real effort to present yourself as the rational person you believe yourself to be. In your own words, you emulate the behavior of a computer or AI, so you understand that like a computer that emulates hardware, your emulation of thinking methodologically happens on top of the blobby mass in your head which is driven by human thoughts, feelings, and those things. I don't think you realize how much that blobby mass seeps through.

To begin with, your desire to think like a computer is irrational because you have no actual reason to do it; you don't have a lofty goal that would require it, nor will it help your survive another day. I would guess that your desire to do that stems from that same desire as before, to be apart from or better than other people. Next, your goals in life just revolve around archiving shit on your computer. You are a digital hoarder. You have given no pretense to why you do this, and in case you claim it's just preservation of software history, I say back that it's very easy for to create a fake justification on the spot for whatever we do. We can even lie to ourselves about why we do what we do, and genuinely believe, but that doesn't change what the truth is. The truth is often too ugly for ourselves. Is there even the tiniest thought deep within that there actually is some irrational reason you hoard files, that you've been too uncomfortable to admit to yourself before?

This brings me to one of your principles which I thought was interesting. Avoid love at all cost, as it will only poison your mind. First of all, these sound like the words of someone with little to no experience, or maybe a bad experience with love, but I'll give the benefit of doubt because I'm not focused on that. I think that these could be the words of someone who so desperately wants to prove how rational they are, they'll flaunt how they don't believe in that irrational thing that all the other irrational people do! But while you obsess over the obvious ways to display rationality, you fail to see what's underneath your own facade, which is that ugly unshakeable web of desires and fears, without reason, and that desperate scrambling inside yourself for homeostasis.

So evaluate yourself fundamentally. What are you hiding from yourself? Are you really 'rational'? What are your desires you don't want to admit that you have?
I hope you may find the truth in yourself manpaint, whether it was as I described or not.

To add onto this in a roundabout way, German Romanticism, was a direct result of the Enlightenment, where everything was being reduced to rationalism and logic and a denial of emotions across the full range(pain, pleasure, love, lust, envy, pride, happiness etc). This German Romanticism is responsible in part for the philosophical views of Nietzsche, Stirner and a lot of other German philosophers(and a lot of German works like Beethoven's 5th, Wagner's Operas e.t.c.)- which usually focused on the concepts of self-actualisation or the Übermensch. This concept of self-actualisation, if one studies Jungian Psychology, requires incorporating the shadow of your ego(everything you bury deep down in your subconscious), which for most people is extremely difficult, so instead you just get modern short-sighted attempts at it by using Maslow's Hierarchy of needs instead(therapay and medication too if it doesn't work well enough).

As Lostinthecycle has mentioned, you should look at yourself and ask what you're hiding from yourself- but teasing that out is very hard as noted above on Jungian Psychology. My general purpose recommendation is to attempt to read some philosophy(since philosophy is effectively a prequel to psychology). It'll give you both knowledge on different value systems, and give you tools towards being your own therapist(you know yourself best, so why shouldn't you be your best therapist?).

 

[manpaint]

Interesting replies. I have not yet the time to read everything that was said, but once I get some free time, will read and consider what have been said in full.

 

[SomaSpice]

Huh, its very interesting that you seek out such a rigid way of life. I actually tend to seek out the opposite, to achieve flow and dissolve onto pure instinct. To have my sense of self go from noun to verb.

I genuinely believe that our emotions and instincts hold the wisdom of the millions of years of trial and error that forged the human species into what it is today, and that we must heed them and direct them, but not repress them, lest we repress the very impulses that makes us vital.

 

[RisingThumb]

Huh, its very interesting that you seek out such a rigid way of life. I actually tend to seek out the opposite, to achieve flow and dissolve onto pure instinct. To have my sense of self go from noun to verb.

I genuinely believe that our emotions and instincts hold the wisdom of the millions of years of trial and error that forged the human species into what it is today, and that we must heed them and direct them, but not repress them, lest we repress the very impulses that makes us vital.

*Proceeds to follow the peer pressure instinct into meth, and proceeds to follow our instinct to continue feeding our addictions*

 

[manpaint]

-------------------------------

If knowledge is your highest priority, read "The Unique and its property". You'll then learn you're an involuntary egoist, establishing these principles out of your own morality. You'll then learn that all morality is a spook. Then you'll realise "Chasing after morals is in vain." and "Seek knowledge, as it will bring you great power." Is contradictory, and your principles are formed out of morality(after all how can you consider a "good" or a "bad" principle? Even utilitarian thinking is a morality).

Interesting, I will read this book on 13 December 2022 as it is when I will have free time.

This post is in contradiction of "Silence is golden, only speak when absolutely necessary.", so your post is already in contradiction of your post.

Well, I suposse I will argue that self improvement is "absolutely necessary". In my next iteration of my principles, I should make use of small paragraphs instead of text strings.

"Avoid love at all cost, as it will only poison your mind.", is life-denying, as love is nothing more than your biology, just like hunger, thirst, needing to use the toilet, blinking, breathing, and all the various emotions that "poison" your mind like envy, lust, jealousy, pride etc- of which I personally think are very useful as they are motivators towards self-improvement.

I think love is pure anathema - especially in the current climate. I personally never had the opportunity to even start dating a girl, but every relationship I witnessed ended up in a very bad way. I think people standards nowadays are too high thanks to social media.

"There is no good or evil, only people.". You have formulated a set of moral principles to guide you, thus there is good and evil in accordance to those principles.

Hmm, it is true that "seeing life in black and white" would be what I would perceive as bad. This will indeed need an update.

"Regardless of what you do, you do not deserve anything.". If my featherless biped, you believe you do not deserve anything, then follow it through to its end point Diogenes the lesser.

This ideology is directly ripped from the book of Job. I think that "being virtuous to have good thing down the live" (as in on a reality/spiritual level) is a trap a lot of people fall into.

"To dream is only summoning suffering.". If you seek knowledge, look into Carl Jung- you'll see the folly of claiming dreams only summon suffering.

I will look into Carl Jung's works on 14 December 2022.

"Brace yourself for the worst outcome, do not believe in hope.". All mathematics is based on Axioms, which are fundamental truths you must believe in otherwise the entire subject cannot exist. I will imply here that disbelief in hope, is also a rejection of all belief(since your writing style clues me that)- which is a rejection of all systems based on axioms.

As the writing of this, I am not fully sure what "Axiom" are. Will research on 15 December 2022.

"Simplicity is key, complexity only bring calamity.". There is a degree to which this is true, however simplify too far and you have a calamity. It's like a piece of music, you should use no more or less notes than you need.

Agreed. This principle could use an addedum.

==================================

My suspicion is that you enjoy the feeling of trying to be something neutral and objective because it makes you feel apart from or better than other people, because everyone knows that logic is always better than feeling at all times in everything whatsoever. It's glaringly obvious in your writing because you deliberately choose technical, inhuman words which sacrifice what you really mean but they look "objective". You had to define what 'the function' was just so you could use the word 'function' where you could have just said 'goal', 'desire', 'want', or 'aim'. You came here to 'collect data', but actually you came here seeking 'viewpoints', 'perspectives', or 'opinions'. You make a real effort to present yourself as the rational person you believe yourself to be. In your own words, you emulate the behavior of a computer or AI, so you understand that like a computer that emulates hardware, your emulation of thinking methodologically happens on top of the blobby mass in your head which is driven by human thoughts, feelings, and those things. I don't think you realize how much that blobby mass seeps through.

The "technological" mindset apperas to give me more some of "psychological power". I think this what people sometimes refer as "the grindset", but I would need to look into this term to truly confirm it.

To begin with, your desire to think like a computer is irrational because you have no actual reason to do it; you don't have a lofty goal that would require it, nor will it help your survive another day. I would guess that your desire to do that stems from that same desire as before, to be apart from or better than other people. Next, your goals in life just revolve around archiving shit on your computer. You are a digital hoarder. You have given no pretense to why you do this, and in case you claim it's just preservation of software history, I say back that it's very easy for to create a fake justification on the spot for whatever we do. We can even lie to ourselves about why we do what we do, and genuinely believe, but that doesn't change what the truth is. The truth is often too ugly for ourselves. Is there even the tiniest thought deep within that there actually is some irrational reason you hoard files, that you've been too uncomfortable to admit to yourself before?

Well, I guess the true reason is that I have a deep distrust for software updates. I don't like when my workflow get altered or when all icons become minimalistic mediocrity to make the app "modern".

I also like losing things in general. Software has the possiblity to be eternal as it is hardware agnostic, which is a thing I really like.

This brings me to one of your principles which I thought was interesting. Avoid love at all cost, as it will only poison your mind. First of all, these sound like the words of someone with little to no experience, or maybe a bad experience with love, but I'll give the benefit of doubt because I'm not focused on that. I think that these could be the words of someone who so desperately wants to prove how rational they are, they'll flaunt how they don't believe in that irrational thing that all the other irrational people do! But while you obsess over the obvious ways to display rationality, you fail to see what's underneath your own facade, which is that ugly unshakeable web of desires and fears, without reason, and that desperate scrambling inside yourself for homeostasis.

I have indeed zero experience with love. It is not implausible that a higher power deliberately do not want me to join another human. Every attempt, I made where stopped by external factors. Here's a few examples:

-First girl I was interested in turned out to be very christian and had no interest in men until she fully finished her education, which was in 20+ years.
-Second girl had a deep distrust of men in general due to something that happened to her mother. I decided to just leave her alone.
-Many others already simply had boyfriends.

From the relationship I observed as a third party, they never lasted and were prone to a lot of conflict. I just decided to not bother. A 40+ year man I met in "college" gave me the same exact advice, so did some teachers there.

So evaluate yourself fundamentally. What are you hiding from yourself? Are you really 'rational'? What are your desires you don't want to admit that you have?
I hope you may find the truth in yourself manpaint, whether it was as I described or not.

I suposse my true desires are as follow:

-I want "the framework" to remain the same. I do not like change, especially downgrades.
-I am somewhat curious about experiencing love but everything indicates that it's a masive lost of time. Not to mention the fact that I am very heliocentric just sound like a receipe for disaster.
-I like behaving like a machine because it gives me motivation and power.

===================================

To add onto this in a roundabout way, German Romanticism, was a direct result of the Enlightenment, where everything was being reduced to rationalism and logic and a denial of emotions across the full range(pain, pleasure, love, lust, envy, pride, happiness etc). This German Romanticism is responsible in part for the philosophical views of Nietzsche, Stirner and a lot of other German philosophers(and a lot of German works like Beethoven's 5th, Wagner's Operas e.t.c.)- which usually focused on the concepts of self-actualisation or the Übermensch. This concept of self-actualisation, if one studies Jungian Psychology, requires incorporating the shadow of your ego(everything you bury deep down in your subconscious), which for most people is extremely difficult, so instead you just get modern short-sighted attempts at it by using Maslow's Hierarchy of needs instead(therapay and medication too if it doesn't work well enough).

As Lostinthecycle has mentioned, you should look at yourself and ask what you're hiding from yourself- but teasing that out is very hard as noted above on Jungian Psychology. My general purpose recommendation is to attempt to read some philosophy(since philosophy is effectively a prequel to psychology). It'll give you both knowledge on different value systems, and give you tools towards being your own therapist(you know yourself best, so why shouldn't you be your best therapist?).

See above.

==================================

[/QUOTE]

Huh, its very interesting that you seek out such a rigid way of life. I actually tend to seek out the opposite, to achieve flow and dissolve onto pure instinct. To have my sense of self go from noun to verb.

I genuinely believe that our emotions and instincts hold the wisdom of the millions of years of trial and error that forged the human species into what it is today, and that we must heed them and direct them, but not repress them, lest we repress the very impulses that makes us vital.

I understand what you are saying. While I dislike emotions, I agree that discarding them outright without an analysis is pure folly.

That being said, my brain and "my heart" often disagree. Here's an comparaison:

You are near bridge. You heart tell you to jump. Your brain is like "well chances are you will die".

This pretty much what I feel with love (although to an obviously lesser degree).

 

[SomaSpice]

*Proceeds to follow the peer pressure instinct into meth, and proceeds to follow our instinct to continue feeding our addictions*

Heed them and direct them, HEED THEM AND DIRECT THEM. *Hits crack pipe*

I understand what you are saying. While I dislike emotions, I agree that discarding them outright without an analysis is pure folly.
That being said, my brain and "my heart" often disagree. Here's an comparaison:
You are near bridge. You heart tell you to jump. Your brain is like "well chances are you will die".
This pretty much what I feel with love (although to an obviously lesser degree)

This is a philosophical conversation above my grade, and I know I won't be able to change your beliefs, but consider this:

When someone talks shit at you, and you feel an impuse of anger, you might feel the need to go and punch him in the face. We all know this is dangerous and socially unacceptable, but think about what your anger is trying to tell you deep down. It demands respect, it doesn't want to be slighted or looked down upon. It wants you to be someone worthy of respect. You can take this impulse and use it to push yourself to become so.

With your bridge example I don't know if you mean depression or vertigo, but since vertigo has to do more with balance and visual perception I'll assume you meant an impulse to commit suicide. I believe this impulse is normal. Its normal to feel melancholic, to think the struggle of living is senseless, that it'd be nice to just die and stop existing. I think this emotion is important because it puts us face to face with death. Humanity hasn't escaped its mortality, so its necessary to acknowledge it.

What I think the temptation to choose death tells us, is precisely just that, we can choose to die. And we will eventually die, so we better choose to die for something. If death seems alluring, life becomes even more so, because you become unshackled from fear. You can live as you will.

Casting aside your emotions, I believe, is like willfully loosing one of your senses.

 

[LostintheCycle]

I like behaving like a machine because it gives me motivation and power.

Honestly I can respect that, so long as you aren't one of those weird transhumanists

I am somewhat curious about experiencing love but everything indicates that it's a masive lost of time. Not to mention the fact that I am very heliocentric just sound like a receipe for disaster.

I promise you it is not. The people who are successful in love I think aren't easy to see but they are there. For me it's particularly meaningful because if not for my girlfriend, I'd probably have become an extremely bitter incel and eventually commit suicide. Love can be life-changing. I'm still with her now too as well, we've been through the ringer for five years now and will get married very soon.
Lots of people have strange ideas about relationships. They talk about relationships like something you have to overthink and minimax your compatibility based on every superfluous trait, but you don't. I think a good relationship comes down only to a strong and comfortable connection between two moral people. It's a very valuable thing to have I think, and has a very strong deep meaning rooted in us all.
I'm sorry I can't give you much advice, other than stay away from dating apps. If you can find it though, I can guarantee you that your life will be positively changed forever.
And don't worry about that heliocentricism man, we are all in this orbiting-the-sun shit together, I'm here for you

 

[manpaint]

Heed them and direct them, HEED THEM AND DIRECT THEM. *Hits crack pipe*


This is a philosophical conversation above my grade, and I know I won't be able to change your beliefs, but consider this:

When someone talks shit at you, and you feel an impuse of anger, you might feel the need to go and punch him in the face. We all know this is dangerous and socially unacceptable, but think about what your anger is trying to tell you deep down. It demands respect, it doesn't want to be slighted or looked down upon. It wants you to be someone worthy of respect. You can take this impulse and use it to push yourself to become so.

With your bridge example I don't know if you mean depression or vertigo, but since vertigo has to do more with balance and visual perception I'll assume you meant an impulse to commit suicide. I believe this impulse is normal. Its normal to feel melancholic, to think the struggle of living is senseless, that it'd be nice to just die and stop existing. I think this emotion is important because it puts us face to face with death. Humanity hasn't escaped its mortality, so its necessary to acknowledge it.

What I think the temptation to choose death tells us, is precisely just that. We can choose to die, and we will eventually die, so we better choose to die for something. If death seems alluring, life becomes even more so because you become unshackled from fear. You can live as you will.

Casting aside your emotions, I believe, is like willfully loosing one of your senses.

The bridge example was a really random example I just picked.

I believe that even through my best effort, I will never be able to get rid of my emotions. For example I have intense fear when I see a specific type of insect. I guess my "doctrine" is more about analyzing any action you do and purge any impulse.

 

[manpaint]

Honestly I can respect that, so long as you aren't one of those weird transhumanists

I promise you it is not. The people who are successful in love I think aren't easy to see but they are there. For me it's particularly meaningful because if not for my girlfriend, I'd probably have become an extremely bitter incel and eventually commit suicide. Love can be life-changing. I'm still with her now too as well, we've been through the ringer for five years now and will get married very soon.
Lots of people have strange ideas about relationships. They talk about relationships like something you have to overthink and minimax your compatibility based on every superfluous trait, but you don't. I think a good relationship comes down only to a strong and comfortable connection between two moral people. It's a very valuable thing to have I think, and has a very strong deep meaning rooted in us all.
I'm sorry I can't give you much advice, other than stay away from dating apps. If you can find it though, I can guarantee you that your life will be positively changed forever.
And don't worry about that heliocentricism man, we are all in this orbiting-the-sun shit together, I'm here for you

I too believe that becoming one with a machine is a very unwise idea. The idea of having an implant controlled by Google is truly has some horrifying implications.

As for relationship, perphaps I will change my mind if I find love "organically", but I still think that chasing after relationship it is a waste of time and can lead you to make a lot of mistake.

 

[SomaSpice]

The bridge example was a really random example I just picked.

I believe that even through my best effort, I will never be able to get rid of my emotions. For example I have intense fear when I see a specific type of insect. I guess my "doctrine" is more about analyzing any action you do and purge any impulse.

Aight, I understand. Hope you have fun and find much success with your life path. I shot my text-load, I've got nothing to add.

 

[RisingThumb]

Well, I suposse I will argue that self improvement is "absolutely necessary". In my next iteration of my principles, I should make use of small paragraphs instead of text strings.

I think love is pure anathema - especially in the current climate. I personally never had the opportunity to even start dating a girl, but every relationship I witnessed ended up in a very bad way. I think people standards nowadays are too high thanks to social media.

Hmm, it is true that "seeing life in black and white" would be what I would perceive as bad. This will indeed need an update.

This ideology is directly ripped from the book of Job. I think that "being virtuous to have good thing down the live" (as in on a reality/spiritual level) is a trap a lot of people fall into.

Seeing self-improvement as necessary is again another moral view- taking "the Unique and its property" into consideration, there are no moral views(but that's a fairly damning thing to do).

A mentor of mine made a remarkably good point about relationships: if you've never been in one you have no place drawing concrete conclusions on it. Consider also that you're using a sliver of anecdotal evidence to condemn an entire faucet of your life. Without that fundamental experience, you have nothing to draw upon for why it is bad or good(in my opinion, it's ultimately good).

Regarding the principle which you derive from the Book of Job - there is no such thing as X deserving Y, only our interpretation of who deserves what. If you consider the fundamental inequalities of everyone in the Human race you'll see it's a bit useless to say you don't deserve anything- it's also self-deprecating and ultimately not conducive to improvement as I believe it promotes learned helplessness(If I don't deserve anything, I never will, ergo I can't do anything to deserve my current lot in life). As for the Book of Job itself, it practically teaches that learned helplessness(or steadfastness in faith) in the face of tragedy is the approach you should take. Look into Slave Morality vs Master Morality from Nietzsche's genealogy of Morals and make up your own mind on whether you want to be like Job.

Casting aside your emotions, I believe, is like willfully loosing one of your senses.

Completely agree, and if you don't know how to listen to it you're probably gonna burnout, or have a meltdown(and for the autistic/INTx MBTI zodiac folk listening to that is hard). If you're feeling emotions, it's like feeling pain- it's a biological signal to tell you something and it's up to you to understand it and not lie to yourself about it by rationalising it away, because yourself is the easiest person in the world to lie to.

 

[manpaint]

Seeing self-improvement as necessary is again another moral view- taking "the Unique and its property" into consideration, there are no moral views(but that's a fairly damning thing to do).

A mentor of mine made a remarkably good point about relationships: if you've never been in one you have no place drawing concrete conclusions on it. Consider also that you're using a sliver of anecdotal evidence to condemn an entire faucet of your life. Without that fundamental experience, you have nothing to draw upon for why it is bad or good(in my opinion, it's ultimately good).

Regarding the principle which you derive from the Book of Job - there is no such thing as X deserving Y, only our interpretation of who deserves what. If you consider the fundamental inequalities of everyone in the Human race you'll see it's a bit useless to say you don't deserve anything- it's also self-deprecating and ultimately not conducive to improvement as I believe it promotes learned helplessness(If I don't deserve anything, I never will, ergo I can't do anything to deserve my current lot in life). As for the Book of Job itself, it practically teaches that learned helplessness(or steadfastness in faith) in the face of tragedy is the approach you should take. Look into Slave Morality vs Master Morality from Nietzsche's genealogy of Morals and make up your own mind on whether you want to be like Job.

Completely agree, and if you don't know how to listen to it you're probably gonna burnout, or have a meltdown(and for the autistic/INTx MBTI zodiac folk listening to that is hard). If you're feeling emotions, it's like feeling pain- it's a biological signal to tell you something and it's up to you to understand it and not lie to yourself about it by rationalising it away, because yourself is the easiest person in the world to lie to.

It is true that relationship has a lot of variables that I have never experienced.

I suposse that for the "Book of Job principle" a better principle would be "The only thing you deserve is what you reap".

As for the "lying to yourself is easy" section, I do often have "internal debates" where two separate concienses are constantly arguing with each others. It is somewhat hard to lie to myself, atleast on a concious level, but perphaps I am just fool. This will require some introspection.

 

[PizzaW0lf]

-I like behaving like a machine because it gives me motivation and power.

For the sake of humans, it's not that great of an idea to only follow 100% facts. It's ok to have some emotions and to not be that machine-like. Perhaps you can hear out this guy's point.
View: https://youtu.be/U24gLMx_B08?t=1032

 

[manpaint]

For the sake of humans, it's not that great of an idea to only follow 100% facts. It's ok to have some emotions and to not be that machine-like. Perhaps you can hear out this guy's point.
View: https://youtu.be/U24gLMx_B08?t=1032

Interesting videos. I have decided to update my principles to add the following:

• Evil is only which has the intent to hurt other people.
• You cannot override your human nature, so account for it.

 

[deepfreeze]

Evil is only which has the intent to hurt other people

I don't think I agree with this. Most evil is not done with the intent of harming others, but rather indifference to their suffering. But here's the thing: It's not possible to care about everyone and everything. So how much indifference does it take for you to become evil?

 

[manpaint]

I don't think I agree with this. Most evil is not done with the intent of harming others, but rather indifference to their suffering. But here's the thing: It's not possible to care about everyone and everything. So how much indifference does it take for you to become evil?

If we follow this thread of logic, I would say that the vast majority of people are "evil" since they do not care how their goods are manufactured. I think we all know the example of clothes being manufactured by heavily exploited workers if not straight slaves. One could argue that the simple act of buying clothes support an exploitative system. As a consequence everyone would be evil as a result of their indiference and passive support.

The problem is that aside maybe for an extreme minority. most people would be labelled as evil under this system. If everyone is evil, the label loses it's value as it no longer makes a clear separation of morals.

 

[bnuungus]

I was gonna comment a little more harshly on your views of relationships but it seems like you've acknowledged that you might not have a complete view on the situation. All I have to offer on this is my own personal experience, which directly contrasts your original view of the matter but I think I agree the most with LostintheCycle's view here:

Lots of people have strange ideas about relationships. They talk about relationships like something you have to overthink and minimax your compatibility based on every superfluous trait, but you don't. I think a good relationship comes down only to a strong and comfortable connection between two moral people. It's a very valuable thing to have I think, and has a very strong deep meaning rooted in us all.

My wife and I started dating in high school and were dating for 7 years before we were able to get married (we wanted to get degrees before completely cutting ourselves off from our parents income). There was a certain point at around year 2 or so, right when the initial infatuation stage starts to wear off, that I started to have doubts about our relationship. It wasn't anything specific, it was just that there was a part of me that doubted that it would last our lifetimes. Well during this doubt a church parish around where I live needed some help stuffing bulletins and my mom suggested that I go and do it for them, along with my now wife. It was in that activity that I fully realized that I wanted to be with her for the rest of our lives. We were doing this simple, menial task, just hanging out together, fully experiencing the boringness of everyday life and I realized that life will always be boring in many places. But I liked being in boredom with her. There wasn't anything special at all about the interaction, it was just that we were able to sit there in the mediocrity of everyday life and it somehow worked. I'll never forget that moment as it was the last emotional block I overcame to be completely 100% sure that I wanted to marry her.

As for relationship, perphaps I will change my mind if I find love "organically", but I still think that chasing after relationship it is a waste of time and can lead you to make a lot of mistake.

I do agree with this. Chasing after relationships out of societal peer pressure is stupid and likely where you get a lot of your distaste for them in general. Not everyone has to be in a relationship and most people pursue them bc they want to fill a void in their hearts that ultimately can't be filled by one person. I will say though that you do have to put yourself out there if you ever do want a relationship. Not on dating apps but in the real world. I don't know specifically how bad your hearing thing is but I suspect it makes it difficult in some ways to do that. Idk the chance for a relationship may or may not come but I would just encourage you to at least be open if it does come your way

I believe that even through my best effort, I will never be able to get rid of my emotions. For example I have intense fear when I see a specific type of insect. I guess my "doctrine" is more about analyzing any action you do and purge any impulse.

no one in this thread has commented on the difference between emotions and feelings but the fact of the matter is, yeah you'll never be rid of them so you might as well harness them to be a more complete version of yourself rather than trying to smother it. My mentality is to control your emotions (not let them control you) and to harness your feelings and use them to help in your decision making. We will never be able to have all of the facts and possible outcomes in our head at once so being able to cultivate your gut feelings to give you better guidance is a crucial skill to have. I've been noodling making a thread on this topic for a while now but I just haven't had the time to write out a cohesive argument. Idk, I guess my point is we're not machines so we shouldn't try to fully act like one. Rather we should use all of the tools at our disposal bc machines will always have better processing power than humans and we should use what we have that machines don't.