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admin

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This board is dedicated to what you see around the world, news and your opinions. It can range from Philosophy, Religion, Conspiracies and Politics. Just remember to keep it civil and don't take anything too seriously.
 
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ColderIsland

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I´m starting to realize capitalism (the way it is right now) sucks. And i think many people feel the same way. Am I still vaporwave if I´m not okay with it? :) I don´t even believe in free will so whatever
PS: this is my first post here, and sorry 4 my bad English, not my first language
 

Eis-T

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@Colderisland: totally! Many Vaporwave artists critique late-capitalism in their work, whether intentional or not. What I find beautiful is the ambivalence in this critique. The capitalist practices and excesses are glorified (mallsoft, internet club, etc) in such a ridiculous over-exaggeration that its praise becomes Ironic and satirical.
When I listen to vaporwave I both fondly remember the optimism of the pre-9/11 era I grew up in and have the unsettling feeling of how pretty much all of that turned out to be a lie.
The chopped and screwed nature of the art (not sure if I'd classify vaporwave as a music genre, I prefer to label it art as the aesthetic is such a large part of it) toghether with the reverb and worn-out tape sound are part of the critique on capitalism's story of progress. It is both satirizing the fake authenticity and showing the cracks in the retro-futurist sounds. In my opinion, good Vaporwave sounds as if it is about to collapse under its own weight.
 
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ColderIsland

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I think capitalism is really bad now. One example I'm seeing is the exploitation of addiction. With that, i mean taking advantage of people´s addictions (selling alcohol and cigarettes, social media, YouTube, games, etc). But as long as you make a profit doesn't matter, right :(

It's so inefficient and it delays progress and happiness. I don't know
 

admin

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ColderIsland said:
I think capitalism is really bad now. One example I'm seeing is the exploitation of addiction. With that, i mean taking advantage of people´s addictions (selling alcohol and cigarettes, social media, YouTube, games, etc). But as long as you make a profit doesn't matter, right :(

It's so inefficient and it delays progress and happiness. I don't know

No I have to disagree. I think capitalism is the best system we have so far. Maybe in the future we could let robots do all the hard labor but I think it's the best we have right now. There is nothing we can do if people want to drink alcohol and smoke cigarettes. Yes it's bad for your health but at the end of the day people have a need for it and other people will fulfill that need. Even if it was illegal, there would still be a black market for it. I dont think we can regulate human nature
 
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Controller of Planet X

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I think the way we talk about modern economic and political systems is outdated. We throw words around like "democracy" or "capitalism", yet it seems as though the modern manifestation of these concepts bears little resemblance to their textbook definitions.

I wonder what pure and real capitalism would look like...
 
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Cugel

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I think the way we talk about modern economic and political systems is outdated. We throw words around like "democracy" or "capitalism", yet it seems as though the modern manifestation of these concepts bears little resemblance to their textbook definitions.

I wonder what pure and real capitalism would look like...
I think the "we've never seen real capitalism" thing is not really true. "Pure capitalism" was the norm for a long time; it was done away with because it has a tendency to self-destruct spectacularly and take down whole countries with it.

Regardless of what you think of his prescription for solving the problem (I don't agree with it), Marx's Capital is a very sober and scientific analysis of why the practice of capitalism is fundamentally unsustainable, and history definitely proved him right on that front. I don't like the way the world works either but governments started implementing this stuff because it (sometimes) allows them to get ahead of the economy and cheat death, basically. Pure capitalism would look a lot like the early 20th century: Constant economic collapses and revolutions accompanied by wars caused by the resulting political upheaval. Would probably be even worse with modern technology though...
 
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Controller of Planet X

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I think the "we've never seen real capitalism" thing is not really true. "Pure capitalism" was the norm for a long time; it was done away with because it has a tendency to self-destruct spectacularly and take down whole countries with it.

Regardless of what you think of his prescription for solving the problem (I don't agree with it), Marx's Capital is a very sober and scientific analysis of why the practice of capitalism is fundamentally unsustainable, and history definitely proved him right on that front. I don't like the way the world works either but governments started implementing this stuff because it (sometimes) allows them to get ahead of the economy and cheat death, basically. Pure capitalism would look a lot like the early 20th century: Constant economic collapses and revolutions accompanied by wars caused by the resulting political upheaval. Would probably be even worse with modern technology though...

We have never seen "pure capitalism" in the sense there are no states that are owned and operated by businesses (Cameralism in Prussia is a relevant here). Such an arrangement wouldn't be tenable on the macro scale (behemoth and decaying countries like the US, Russia, China, etc).

On the micro-scale though...

A world comprised of competing sovereign corporate nationstates would create competition. Competition creates true progress and advancement. The goal should not be complacent peace and simple minded prosperity.
 
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Cugel

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We have never seen "pure capitalism" in the sense there are no states that are owned and operated by businesses (Cameralism in Prussia is a relevant here). Such an arrangement wouldn't be tenable on the macro scale (behemoth and decaying countries like the US, Russia, China, etc).

On the micro-scale though...

A world comprised of competing sovereign corporate nationstates would create competition. Competition creates true progress and advancement. The goal should not be complacent peace and simple minded prosperity.
I can't say I agree, but judging from some of the noises being made by important people at the World Economic Forum lately you just might get your wish...
 
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