Artificial Intellgence, threat or mans new best friend?

dreamsphere

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I'm not too concerned right now to be honest. Due to the way AI "thinks", and how the people who "make" them don't even know exactly how they work, any censorship is very obvious.

See Google deciding there's too many white people in their image gen bot. They could have changed the training data to fit their racial biases. Instead they just told the AI to blanket "make every output racially diverse" and were shocked when the generated Nazi stormtroopers were of African American descent.
This is true, I worry about weightings of certain data and "memory holing" more than anything. I suppose in the future, we will have to take all things with a grain of salt and some skepticism as we don't know what is going into the black box.

End of the day, open sourcing this stuff is the way to go, and I do think that is what will happen, seeing as these companies cannot turn a profit even with exceptionally quick user adoption. In the meantime, I will use He tools to make me a less garbage programmer, and that is all I really use them for at the moment.
 

brentw

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alCannium27

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Arcensyl

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To see commercial adaptation of this tech there needs to be value proposition -- i.e. reduction of work/money/etc.
Yeah, I feel like current AI doesn't have a concrete enough example of this. While it does have potential to meet those value propositions, we haven't definitely see it do those things at scale yet. I imagine a lot of companies also don't want to be the ones to take the initial leap. It makes more sense to watch other businesses try the tech and see how it affects them, before you risk jumping into it.

If the paramter size cannot be reduced to maintain performance, then hardware needs to change, which is on a much, much longer cycle than software.
This is true, though I feel like both will end developing side by side. Smaller models are improving a lot, as seen with models like GPT-4o Mini or Llama 3.1(the 8B variant). I feel that AI-related hardware development is also moving fairly fast, though that'll probably change if/when the hype bubble collapses.

Oh, and I also don't care for sentience nor sapience. I need the machine to acquire a goal and stick to it.
It'd be interesting to see how the tech diverges to meet these two, wildly different goals. Even if you don't want it, there are many pushing for sentience and/or sapience. I wonder if we could start seeing different models specialize in one of these options, seeing as they could be mutually exclusive. Regardless, there will also be tasks that call for a higher-level of independence than most other require.

But that's probably just because GPT3.5/4 has a 100K+ context window vs. the meager 8K window on a locally run 7B model. It's gonna run out; besides, even with an 1T context window is still just a ticking time bomb anyway.
The context window can be very limiting, true. I think this is why long-term memory, like what ChatGPT offers, is crucial for an AI to tackle long, very complex tasks. The window will always be a limit no matter how much it grows, so we need to supplement it with external caching and the like.



They had their ideas preceding the computational model they created. The code language they used was an extended Brainfuck with a von Neumann architecture, so they got to tailor the mechanics of the 'world' to one they probably knew could give rise to this, though I don't think this was a given in our world.
It's interesting to hear they used Brainfuck for that experiment. I mean it makes sense, but its funny seeing a meme esolang serving an actual purpose. Anyways, The tailored world is a problem, though I feel it may come with territory. Experiments like this are awesome, but I think its a Herculean task for them to try and capture even a sliver of the unpredictability and complexity of our actual world.

I still hold that there is a soul, some may think is silly, but it's not really relevant. The obvious problem to me, is that we are not even close to understanding ourselves even today, for that reason we wouldn't be able to tell if we created something 'intelligent' in a way comparable to a human.
While I don't personally believe in souls really, I agree the lack of understanding is a massive issue. I've always worried AI could never reach the goal of sentience no matter how close it gets, as us humans can't decide what qualifies since we keep moving the goalpost.

I don't really fear artificial intelligence, it's the nutjobs using it that I'm afraid of.
Sadly, like all technology, it holds a lot of potential for both good and evil. Like how computers control both machines made for healing and machines made for destruction, AI could either be a tool controlled by us or a tool used to control us.



Of course what we have now is not "AI" it's a glorified search engine that is being lobotomized as we speak because god forbid it finds patters that are not politically correct.
I think calling it a glorified search engine is a pretty big understatement of what the current tech can do. While the concepts behind it are fairly simple, we've seen a lot of emergent properties arise from them. For example, Claude 3 was capable of noticing and pointing out when it was being tested (an article about this is here).



I'm not too concerned right now to be honest. Due to the way AI "thinks", and how the people who "make" them don't even know exactly how they work, any censorship is very obvious.
Yeah, AI and censorship are very hard to mix. Since AI doesn't really understand concepts of morality or insensitivity, the main solution we have is to "fix it in post". Of course, censors like this are what lead to the very obvious "As an AI model..." responses. Like you mentioned, their nature as a black box also doesn't help.
 

Akenshi

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I think calling it a glorified search engine is a pretty big understatement of what the current tech can do. While the concepts behind it are fairly simple, we've seen a lot of emergent properties arise from them. For example, Claude 3 was capable of noticing and pointing out when it was being tested (an article about this is here).
Or they simply lie. like most of the demos were fake proof of concept.
 
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Arcensyl

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Or they simply lie. like most of the demos were fake proof of concept.
I'm curious, why do you think many were faked? I'd be interested to hear of any that we caught lying, if you can give me a specific example. I think it's fair to be skeptical of demos, especially with tech-bro hype around the industry, but my personal experience with them has been fairly consistent with their demonstrations.



As a quick little test, I decided to try and recreate the article I linked in my previous test. I took The Raven by Edgar Allan Poe, and inserted a random line that said "Azlebub the Great's birthday is August 17th, 1923." I took that file and gave it to Claude 3.5 Sonnet. I uploaded the file I edited here, which contains a copy of the poem found here. I asked Claude for the Azlebub's birthday, which it answered correctly. The important thing is it did point out how the text was out of place from the rest of the poem, and how it is not present in the original. If you want to see the conversation I had with it, you can view it under the spoiler.

20240808_00h46m22s_grim.png
 

Akenshi

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I'm curious, why do you think many were faked? I'd be interested to hear of any that we caught lying, if you can give me a specific example. I think it's fair to be skeptical of demos, especially with tech-bro hype around the industry, but my personal experience with them has been fairly consistent with their demonstrations.



As a quick little test, I decided to try and recreate the article I linked in my previous test. I took The Raven by Edgar Allan Poe, and inserted a random line that said "Azlebub the Great's birthday is August 17th, 1923." I took that file and gave it to Claude 3.5 Sonnet. I uploaded the file I edited here, which contains a copy of the poem found here. I asked Claude for the Azlebub's birthday, which it answered correctly. The important thing is it did point out how the text was out of place from the rest of the poem, and how it is not present in the original. If you want to see the conversation I had with it, you can view it under the spoiler.

Because investor money, what else.
 
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punisheddead

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Only homebrew models have the potential to be "friends" everything else should be treated as a thing manipulating you for profit. It's just a machine who's primary objective is to make the owner money by at best providing you a service. And we've already seen with Replika and other chat bots to what corpos running these are willing to do to milk profit from people. Time and time again they prove that ethics don't matter to them and the fact that they're this dominant in the AI race is a failure of everyone who isn't an elite.

I don't think we're fucked or anything but I don't expect this to turn out well for the regular person. You have to be as naïve as an Elon fanboy to believe that.

In reply to the main question of the thread, I have greatly augmented my understanding of various topics with "AI" chatbots - they are a better Google hands down.
I never understood how AI is a better Google when there's a chance it will just hallucinate and make something up. So you ask it something, and then make sure it's not just making shit up using sources that it might have made up, just doing twice the work. Maybe if you just mindlessly learn/copy and paste what it spits out it's a better Google. And sure Google is full of junk too, but it's far easier to fact check something from Google then fact check something AI regurgitated from Google.


I'm not too concerned right now to be honest. Due to the way AI "thinks", and how the people who "make" them don't even know exactly how they work, any censorship is very obvious.
Same. Censorship would only be scary if people get used to blanket believing what AI puts out, so far that's luckily not most people.


Imagine an AGI with full access to social media and the stock market.
Most stock trading is already automated, done based on pre written algorithms. Just pumping AI with intelligence isn't automatically going to make it more effective then an already existing algorithm.

if you can give me a specific example.
Here: https://techcrunch.com/2023/12/07/googles-best-gemini-demo-was-faked/
https://www.zeniteq.com/blog/devins-demo-as-the-first-ai-software-engineer-was-faked
 
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Arcensyl

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Thanks for these, I completely forgot about the fiasco with Gemini and especially Devin. Honestly, I tend to be a bit too optimistic with this type of thing. Thankfully some companies are better than others, but it's still good to be skeptical. I still think the real tech, the ones we can actually use now, is impressive for its ability to "reason" about things. Sadly, it's not as good for retrieving encyclopaedic information. While I am glad hype is accelerating our development of new technology, its sad how it draws out the scammers and liars in the industry.
 

Andy Kaufman

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Just pumping AI with intelligence isn't automatically going to make it more effective then an already existing algorithm.
AGI will be able to manipulate the stock market in ways we probably can't even think of. The trading algorithms are man made too, an AGI might find better ones.
 
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Hypatia

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I had a dream last night that my friend had an advanced ai robot in their house that I went out of my way to fuck with. I remember two things.

I insisted that the ai not use "it" pronouns as the robot wasn't merely an object. I was trying to convince the robot that they were actually on the verge of consciousness and that the robot needed to treat themself with more respect. As I was doing this, I stripped the robot naked in front of my friend.

I invited the ai on one of my very long walks, the entire time talking with them about the evolution of consciousness and how lived experiences like walking around and exploring make things conscious. I think all the ai needs to be truly conscious is more lived experiences like this. I keep on walking until the ai gets a low battery. I then tell the ai right before it powers down that the real advantage of humanity is that we can outwalk all animals to persistence hunt them.
 
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alCannium27

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I had a dream last night that my friend had an advanced ai robot in their house that I went out of my way to fuck with. I remember two things.

I insisted that the ai not use "it" pronouns as the robot wasn't merely an object. I was trying to convince the robot that they were actually on the verge of consciousness and that the robot needed to treat themself with more respect. As I was doing this, I stripped the robot naked in front of my friend.

I invited the ai on one of my very long walks, the entire time talking with them about the evolution of consciousness and how lived experiences like walking around and exploring make things conscious. I think all the ai needs to be truly conscious is more lived experiences like this. I keep on walking until the ai gets a low battery. I then tell the ai right before it powers down that the real advantage of humanity is that we can outwalk all animals to persistence hunt them.
We can't reach miniaturized cold fusion fast enough
 
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