The Stop Killing Games Movement

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Ross_Я

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So I recently learmed about the "Stop Killing Games" movement. In short a large group of people are trying to get various governement around the globe to outlaw planned obscolesence in video games (always online games). Their "send a lot of signals" method is pretty interesting and might even work.
Just get rid of constant online connection DRM stuff. Ta-da, problem solved. You do not need half an hour long video for the obvious take. Besides, everyone who thought online-only approach will be bad already said it when Diablo 3 came out. It changed nothing, so I doubt anything will change now.
Godspeed though, I definitely root for them. I just do not hold high hopes. Or any other hopes.
 
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Jade

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I've been following Ross for years now, he's been protesting planned obsolescence for ages and I remember him talking about it as far back as his Battleforge vid in 2015. He has all my support, and I usually don't buy DRM games for exactly these reasons. Although ironically, one of the only always-online games I do care about, Wizard101, might actually BENEFIT from being shut down because it has a huge playerbase to this day and I guarantee you there would be a fan crack and fan-hosted servers within the month, managed with far more skill and passion than anything Kingsisle has done for the game in the last few years.
 
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Just get rid of constant online connection DRM stuff. Ta-da, problem solved. You do not need half an hour long video for the obvious take. Besides, everyone who thought online-only approach will be bad already said it when Diablo 3 came out. It changed nothing, so I doubt anything will change now.
Godspeed though, I definitely root for them. I just do not hold high hopes. Or any other hopes.
What's hopeful here is Ross is working with lawyers on a case to get rid of this, using a French law and the fact that Ubisoft is based in France. IANAL so I don't know the specifics. That's what those videos are about - not just the problem or solution, but how to legally get video game publishers to be forced to have good practices.

Its very first-world-problemsy, but Ross is using his youtube eyes to try and get people to solve a problem. I'm allowing myself to be hopeful they can legally screw Ubisoft and set a legal precedent to stop this stuff.
 
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Ross_Я

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And I've thought soviet stuff is out there.

SovTVsex.jpg


Either way, I see. Well, as I said, godspeed. Otherwise, I'd rather ignore the matter; no one in EU or US is going to listen to my country these days around either way.
 
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Just get rid of constant online connection DRM stuff. Ta-da, problem solved. You do not need half an hour long video for the obvious take. Besides, everyone who thought online-only approach will be bad already said it when Diablo 3 came out. It changed nothing, so I doubt anything will change now.
Godspeed though, I definitely root for them. I just do not hold high hopes. Or any other hopes.
I do agree that he kinda took forever to explain his opinion. He probably lost ton of people in the process.

I think the issue is a bit more complex than you think it is. We are all familiar with games that use online-only DRM but can technically run offline is the measure is bypassed (like most games on Steam), then you have single player games which can technically run offline, but core parts of the game are online for some reason (i.e SimCity 2013). You then have game that require online infrastructure that can be emulated but is difficult to do so (MMORPG, Gacha games etc). In the final circle of hell you have cloud gaming games where zero art assets is transfered on the customer's device, meaning even a fan made revival is straight up impossible.
 

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I think the issue is a bit more complex than you think it is. We are all familiar with games that use online-only DRM but can technically run offline is the measure is bypassed (like most games on Steam), then you have single player games which can technically run offline, but core parts of the game are online for some reason (i.e SimCity 2013). You then have game that require online infrastructure that can be emulated but is difficult to do so (MMORPG, Gacha games etc). In the final circle of hell you have cloud gaming games where zero art assets is transfered on the customer's device, meaning even a fan made revival is straight up impossible.
No, I'm quite familiar with everything about it, up to the point that with enough time and dedication even online structure indeed can be emulated. By the way, that Star Wars Galaxy emulator project is still alive, wow!
Anyway, all those things - even cloud services - are at least stated to be done in order to "reduce the amount of piracy" or something, hence why I am feeling free to simply call them all DRM. And yes, the solution to all of this - regardless of how you want to call them - is still simply stop accepting anything that forces you to be constantly online, stop paying any money, any money at all for it and bashing this notion into the minds of the majority until fat cats will finally start losing their money.
Start contributing to it right now! Step one: delete Steam and never install it again. But no, people are going to choose convenience over their freedoms. We already had these conversations on Agora:
I dislike Steam's DRM but at least they let me buy games outright.
Some of us choose not to pirate, not because we are so rich, but because we want to support the creators of the games. This is a signal to them that says, "I want more of your work." But when you pirate from the indie developer you quite literally tell them that they shouldn't make more and you end up in the current situation where the games that are available are big-budget mega-boring corporate team approved bland and boring games.

People will provide a million and a one reason for their decision to support the current system, one way or another. For the second post specifically, as the answer is not obvious: if you love indie games and want to support them - instead of buying them actually take some fucking time and contact devs. Ask them if you can send your money directly. Ask them if you can help in any other way. Overall, it all boils down to convenience again: it is much easier to show your token of support by throwing money rather than by actual interaction. After all, devs can reply with something awful. Like, instead of asking for money they might actually ask for a test of a beta build of their newer game - the horror!
I did it multiple times, if anything. It's not that hard to write "I hate Steam, do you accept direct donations as I do not want to buy your game there?" - most of indie devs will actually understand this notion themselves.

Once again: I'm glad there's finally a bridge too far. I just want to say that all of the things your post mentioned - from Steam's DRM to cloud services - are a part of one problem which can be resolved rather easily if people could just keep their wallets shut for a year or so.
 
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No, I'm quite familiar with everything about it, up to the point that with enough time and dedication even online structure indeed can be emulated. By the way, that Star Wars Galaxy emulator project is still alive, wow!
Anyway, all those things - even cloud services - are at least stated to be done in order to "reduce the amount of piracy" or something, hence why I am feeling free to simply call them all DRM. And yes, the solution to all of this - regardless of how you want to call them - is still simply stop accepting anything that forces you to be constantly online, stop paying any money, any money at all for it and bashing this notion into the minds of the majority until fat cats will finally start losing their money.
Start contributing to it right now! Step one: delete Steam and never install it again. But no, people are going to choose convenience over their freedoms. We already had these conversations on Agora:
When you are informed the problem is not as bad indeed. What makes me very sad is all the kids growing up right now that will have their favorite game artificially bricked in the future and they won't know any better. I sometime curse myself for liking RuneScape so much as that game will inevitably dissapear.

For modern games, I dislike Steam's DRM but at least they let me buy games outright.

The Steam situation is interesting. As a Windows 7 loyalist, support for Steam ended earlier this year. In preparation for this, I looked up how to remove DRM from the few Steam games I ever purchased. Some of you may have heard the rumor that Steam has a end of life policy to remove DRM. I am somewhat inclined to believe this is true. Like 98% games on Steam use a universal DRM solution. Although the implementation varies depending on the age of the game, it essentially boils down to either putting a .dll file in the game folder or running the game's main executable. This kinda feels like malicious compliance in a way. I don't have enough data to back this up (sample size is only 2 games lol), but it seems like the older the game is, the more "draconian" the DRM is - meaning they would have purposely crippled their own system in recent year. That being, devs can add more DRM on top of the generic one, so that may be what happened here.

Still, I am not ever purchasing a game from a digital storefront with DRM again. I wish GOG would not reject my payment options (pre-paid credit cards). Oh well, no more vidya for me.
 

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The Steam situation is interesting. As a Windows 7 loyalist, support for Steam ended earlier this year. In preparation for this, I looked up how to remove DRM from the few Steam games I ever purchased.
Salute to a fellow Win7 user.
As for Steam - Goldberg Steam Emulator.
Most of the games work with a simple drag-and-drop. Even the "replace Steam ID with a correct one" step is not always mandatory.

Still, I am not ever purchasing a game from a digital storefront with DRM again. I wish GOG would not reject my payment options (pre-paid credit cards). Oh well, no more vidya for me.
Double thumbs up. I gave up on GOG for the same reason about several years ago. It was the last place where I used to buy games, but from that point on I went full pirate and vowed to never turn back again. Thus ended my rather long-lasting sympathy for licensed games.
 
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Salute to a fellow Win7 user.
As for Steam - Goldberg Steam Emulator.
Most of the games work with a simple drag-and-drop. Even the "replace Steam ID with a correct one" step is not always mandatory.
My Steam game preservation project has been done many months ago, but thanks for the info. I am sure others will appreciate.

Anyway, I am thankful that I only had 23 games in my library (only 9 which I wanted to archive). If my friend would ever go down the same path as me, I would not envy him for having to un-DRM 210 games lol.
 
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Update: I got word from Ross that the Australian petition is now open: https://www.aph.gov.au/e-petitions/petition/EN6080 (no need to have purchased The Crew).

It was also reported that he got in touch with an Australian law firm and now has a good chance of getting the attention of getting the ACCC's attention.
 
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People will provide a million and a one reason for their decision to support the current system, one way or another. For the second post specifically, as the answer is not obvious: if you love indie games and want to support them - instead of buying them actually take some fucking time and contact devs. Ask them if you can send your money directly. Ask them if you can help in any other way. Overall, it all boils down to convenience again: it is much easier to show your token of support by throwing money rather than by actual interaction. After all, devs can reply with something awful. Like, instead of asking for money they might actually ask for a test of a beta build of their newer game - the horror!
I did it multiple times, if anything. It's not that hard to write "I hate Steam, do you accept direct donations as I do not want to buy your game there?" - most of indie devs will actually understand this notion themselves.

My time is worth something and I don't feel like doing free labor. But they are more than free to publish on GoG or any other market really.

70% of profits go to the dev, 30% to steam.

They get access to the #1 games market
Easy distribution
Support
Easy collection of funds

They'd have to essentially replicate the infrastructure of steam to do their own distribution. Money is how we signal across market economies in that we are offered a price and we can accept or deny the purchase. Plus there are always tons of sales available and you can score great deals on fun games. Sure you could pirate their games, I guess. Though then you are just harming an indie developer unless you pay them for the game, but then why not just pay them to begin with and get a clean copy? I guess there is a problem if you are blocked from the market though.
 
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Ross_Я

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My time is worth something and I don't feel like doing free labor. But they are more than free to publish on GoG or any other market really.
In other words, you just put your comfort above anything else. Your time? What, 10 minutes? 15? Cut it out of the game's cost when you send the money to the devs directly if you value your time that much, but I doubt your time is worth fucking anything, really, You post on Agora, after all, for free. Your time is nothing.
 
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In other words, you just put your comfort above anything else. Your time? What, 10 minutes? 15? Cut it out of the game's cost when you send the money to the devs directly if you value your time that much, but I doubt your time is worth fucking anything, really, You post on Agora, after all, for free. Your time is nothing.
If I wanted to do extra labor and help with video games I might as well cut out all the middlemen and make my own game. I do have the skills to do it. I am not interested in doing free labor. Just pay the $12 and buy the game.

You are equating me showing up here for ~5 minutes to performing hours and possibly days of free labor for an indie developer when I can just give them money so they can pay indians or others to do the same labor at far cheaper rates. Heck, they might even get more labor out of them than they would out of me. Apples to oranges.
 
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If we were millennials we would just reeeeee and scream *Exploitation! (Marx)
But as zoomers (in this era), we just accept it, *So what...
Blaming everyone, ourselves, others... and nothing out of it, - %it is just how it is nowadays, we let Reagans and Thatchers trick(le) us (down) with promises of infinite growth - when we know it will make Earth unliveable (CO2 or not, if you mine all of Earth, it will end)...
But everyone !!accept!! whatever nowadays, just *To get the rid of those bÿro cooks from EU, ECB, WEF...

Same way, (antigamer, and others) parents would accept KOSSA even if it meant(?) ISPs would get what they want... Here we go, *Accepting shit just from unwillingness to talk this out, to *Fix by quick, half-baked or delib. draconic measures...
 
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Guys, please stay on topic. What you are arguing about is mostly unrelated to the "online-only" problem. While I get the argument that Steam's dominance caused lots of game having DRM, I don't think that's the right topic to talk about this tbh.
 

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You are equating me showing up here for ~5 minutes to performing hours and possibly days of free labor
What?
Just which step will take you hours or days? Finding a contact? Writing an e-mail? Transfering the money?
And I'm not asking you to spend those hours or day. If you haven't found the contact info in 15 minutes or - obviously you might as well forget about it, don't be an idiot. Though it never happened in my life: in the year 2024 all the contact infos are just there.
 
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